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08 June 2011 @ 02:46 pm
Don't profiteer me, man  
I've been thinking a lot about ways to change the way I talk, so as to reflect my values in my speech. Just as I would never use racist phrases like "I jewed him down" or "I got gypped" to describe financial transactions, I would like to stop using the word "lame" to refer to people's disappointing behavior, because while I don't value disappointment, I think that aligning social poor form with physical disability is ... lame stupid a bad habit of speech that supports ways of thinking that I disapprove of and don't want to be part of.

Similarly, I think sex is a great thing in the world, so I don't really want to buy into sex-negativity by using "fucker" as an insult, and I like bodies, so describing someone as a body part when instead I mean that s/he was rude or acted inappropriately ... Well, you see where I'm going with this.

Several people have suggested some insults that reflect more of my values: "profiteer", for example, or "bourgeois" (there's a hand gesture that goes with this one). But I need more! Do you have any terms or phrases that come in handy as insults or denigrating descriptors that align with your values? Please share them!
 
 
I'm feeling: curiouscurious
 
 
 
... in a handbasket: Scrunchiinahandbasket on June 8th, 2011 07:16 pm (UTC)
Gypped! Holy crap, never put two and two together on that one... bleh.
ruthless compassion: blech!aroraborealis on June 8th, 2011 07:21 pm (UTC)
I know! I clued into that one pretty late, too, and I was super disappointed about it! I actually only figured it out after the first time I heard "jewed", and then I was like, "Waaaaait a minute..."
(no subject) - blk on June 8th, 2011 07:23 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - harimad on June 8th, 2011 07:38 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - gentlescholar on June 8th, 2011 07:45 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - metagnat on June 8th, 2011 08:02 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - amber_phoenix on June 8th, 2011 09:13 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - meadmaker on June 9th, 2011 01:56 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - aroraborealis on June 8th, 2011 08:33 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - shut_it_already on June 8th, 2011 09:12 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - harimad on June 9th, 2011 01:29 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dreams_of_wings on June 9th, 2011 01:40 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(Deleted comment)
(no subject) - contessagrrl on June 8th, 2011 08:17 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Renata Piperlyonesse on June 8th, 2011 07:16 pm (UTC)
i guess i'm pretty literal. i (think i?) use words like "rude", "incompetent", "lazy", "lying", "false", "disappointing".
ruthless compassion: thinkyaroraborealis on June 8th, 2011 07:23 pm (UTC)
There's value in that, but I also think there's active value in using metaphors, both because they can be a little more emotionally satisfying sometimes, and because they can actively work to influence the way people think about things (like the inherent ablism of "lame" as a complaint or insult). I just want to use metaphors that reflect how I really feel and think and value qualities, characteristics, and people in the world.
(no subject) - lyonesse on June 8th, 2011 07:42 pm (UTC) (Expand)
coorr on June 8th, 2011 07:18 pm (UTC)

I have a friend who has replaced his bad habit of calling things "gay" with calling them "republican."

As in "That's soooo republican!"
unintentionally intimidatingcoraline on June 8th, 2011 08:38 pm (UTC)
this reminds me of dan savage's substitution of "leotarded" for "retarded".
funner'n a sack a weaselsmoominmolly on June 8th, 2011 07:21 pm (UTC)
Interesting. I think this will lead to you using a lot of long, descriptive phrases about stuff you dislike, rather than learning new insults, but it's not necessarily a bad thing.

The etymology of "jerk" is probably unclear enough that it might be safe. I'm also not a fan of what Ani called excessive hygiene, which, aside from the ew factor, would allow "douchebag". I also never liked "bitch", but I admit to a basic apathy toward dogs that makes it also a candidate. Ex-coworker Justin liked to call people "meatballs" or "meatheads", which I still use, if only in my mind. "Boor". "Sketchy". "Manky." "Elbow licker".

I like "bourgeois" and sparkymonster turned me on to "bourgie". I've heard people getting a lot of mileage out of "emo" recently, though I have mixed feelings about that one.

There are also all kinds of short, sweet descriptive terms: self-centered, annoying, loud, smelly, entitled, ignorant...
metagnatmetagnat on June 8th, 2011 08:04 pm (UTC)
Re: douchebag

I have also seen the argument that, as douching removes good bacteria and therefore opens the way to more serious fungal/bacterial issues that douches are, indeed, actively harmful to women and equating something to a douchebag is often an accurate metaphor.
Crossletcrosslet on June 8th, 2011 07:27 pm (UTC)
For the record, bourgeois is also a family surname. So that might also be insulting to that family.

A lot of the older insults have lost initial context and currently I think they get used without realizing the history. I never realized the context of gypped until I saw it spelled out in your post. Similarly growing up in Southern LA "jewed" wasn't the pejorative it might be here. It was used in the same context as shrewd. I didn't appreciate how insulting it was until I moved here. Oddly, I don't think I've ever used lame for a human in the physical sense. Always with horses but that might be atypical.
harimad on June 8th, 2011 07:42 pm (UTC)
Insults that align with my values:
stupid
ignorant
irrational
jerk
jackass
rude
moron

I'm noticing a trend here, although I would never use 'retarded' as an insult. I guess a century ago I would not have used 'moron' either.
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(no subject) - pumpkin_pi on June 9th, 2011 04:54 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - harimad on June 9th, 2011 10:29 am (UTC) (Expand)
"I've been ionized.  But I'm okay now."gentlescholar on June 8th, 2011 07:44 pm (UTC)
I picked up, "Nykulturni" from Heinlein, Russian for "uncultured" but with connotations of extreme insult. I tend to say it when I see someone litter, or be otherwise socially irresponsible in public.

I think of "ass" as short for "jackass", for showing stubborn and stupid and contrary behavior. Not fond of "asshole."

When you take away religion and bodily functions, ("Sacred Feces!", I hear you cry), there aren't a whole lot of curses left, which annoys me. I sometimes use "Frell" from Farscape, which was clearly meant as a synonym for "fuck", though.

I have no idea of the origin of "scumbag" and upon consideration I probably don't want to know...

I often use "moron" and "idiot" when I mean "fool." A bad habit I am rarely reminded is one.

I refer to "bad" Republicans as "neo con men."
I'm also a bit free with "sociopath."
I refer to myself as a Luddite.
"Maniac" is for dangerous driving.
"infantile" is a good one, though I haven't used it much.
The Hebrew Hammercockhammercock on June 8th, 2011 07:44 pm (UTC)
Occasionally I have used "extruded plastic dingus," a phrase from the movie The Hudsucker Proxy, as an epithet. It's great because it sounds rude and kind of dirty, but doesn't actually denigrate any particular human characteristic or group of people.
Mizarchivist: Huhmizarchivist on June 8th, 2011 07:45 pm (UTC)
what to do, what to do....
For quite a while I've been torn about my sex-negative defaults. But I lack options that really have that visceral quality when I say them. And I certainly would have to do some serious reprogramming to STOP saying them. Then when I did, I'd still have 2 other people in the house who may not feel a need to reprogram, which makes my own reprogramming that much more challenging.

However, I do find that certain new turns of phrase can catch on at my house. We are clearly susceptible to memes. I could see if one or two catch on. Only if they find said new word(s) appropriately satisfying to say. "Elbow Licker" seems a good start.
(Deleted comment)
Purple Vengeance Versiondr_memory on June 8th, 2011 07:52 pm (UTC)
I am going to keep reposting this until it becomes a thing:



INHJ, IHLJ "That's some seriously advanced bullshit right there."

Edited at 2011-06-08 07:52 pm (UTC)
Molotov Coqtiz: pic#110805573eestiplika on June 8th, 2011 08:36 pm (UTC)
I think this may be a new favorite. :: prepares to use it rigorously::
(no subject) - coraline on June 8th, 2011 08:42 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - signsoflife on June 11th, 2011 01:52 am (UTC) (Expand)
kinesthetic chutzpah: monkeydilletante on June 8th, 2011 07:56 pm (UTC)
if this forces you to go through a period of highly poetic insults, i'm not sure that will be a bad thing! :) or if it forces you to think hard about exactly what it is you're trying to insult, even better...

are you trying to just avoid insults that secretly contain ideas counter to your values, or are you trying to promote other values by shoehorning a lot of complex emotional implications about broad topics into the small space of your insult the same way that ones that you dislike do?
ruthless compassion: pouncearoraborealis on June 8th, 2011 08:07 pm (UTC)
are you trying to just avoid insults that secretly contain ideas counter to your values, or are you trying to promote other values by shoehorning a lot of complex emotional implications about broad topics into the small space of your insult the same way that ones that you dislike do?

Both! Can I have both?
(no subject) - dilletante on June 8th, 2011 08:16 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - aroraborealis on June 8th, 2011 08:37 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dilletante on June 8th, 2011 08:49 pm (UTC) (Expand)
phoenixamber_phoenix on June 8th, 2011 08:05 pm (UTC)
"capitalist!"
(gets a fair bit of use in my household, though I may be even more fond of "profiteer!")
"I've been ionized.  But I'm okay now."gentlescholar on June 8th, 2011 08:25 pm (UTC)
I'm a little disturbed that "capitalist" can be considered an insult, even by connotation. I mean, everyone in America with a job is a capitalist.
(no subject) - aroraborealis on June 8th, 2011 08:38 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dilletante on June 8th, 2011 09:03 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - amber_phoenix on June 8th, 2011 09:11 pm (UTC) (Expand)
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(no subject) - entrope on June 9th, 2011 01:07 pm (UTC) (Expand)
metagnatmetagnat on June 8th, 2011 08:15 pm (UTC)
I have been trying to replace "lame" in my own vocabulary as well. I usually use "weak" instead, as I feel like "weak" connotes a relative state. It has been argued to me that the use of weak is also abelist as some folks have a disability characterized by their physical weakness. I don't know what to do about my brain habits in the face of that. Any insult that is a characteristic that could be viewed as negative which someone involuntarily has would, of course, sometimes sting that person. Avoiding all words for which that's true is difficult, but I am trying to raise my own awareness, as well.

In terms of other insults that are more neutral: I like chum sucker or scum sucker. Those both sound like unpleasant things to be. You could also go really classy and pull insults out of literature:

Mendicant! Fop! Lewdster! Bootless Canker-Blossom!

These, of course, have some of the same problems as insulting words our culture tends uses today, but they are farther removed from people's consciousness.

Then there's the route of making up your own or using words other folks made up: Santorum and Belgium fall into that category, though, of course, they're also insulting by pulling the erstwhile senator and the country into disrepute by association.

Part of the intent of insults is to sting people by associating them with groups considered undesirable and lesser by many. It's difficult to build up an insult structure that doesn't go to that place.
metagnatmetagnat on June 8th, 2011 08:20 pm (UTC)
Ooh, there is also the quotation or contextual insult. One must be well-read to pull that off, though, and the object of one's insult must be well-read or one must get a thrill out of being too educated to be understood.
(no subject) - aroraborealis on June 8th, 2011 08:39 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - metagnat on June 8th, 2011 09:11 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Pumpkin Pi: pumpkin_pipumpkin_pi on June 8th, 2011 08:47 pm (UTC)
Hmmmm, so what's your take on the phrase "pig fucker" instead of "fucker"?
ruthless compassion: laughteraroraborealis on June 8th, 2011 08:50 pm (UTC)
Oh, that one can definitely stay.
(no subject) - catness on June 8th, 2011 08:59 pm (UTC) (Expand)